| Author |
Comment |
Andy Long
Unregistered User
(7/11/00 2:27:05 pm)
| Tumble
at King?
I understand that I good friend of
mine, Bill Snyder, who I used to fly with in Montana came down under
canopy in the Lemhi Valley on Sunday according to a couple of pilot
witnesses on the ground. Bill's ok but the glider is totalled,
partly from getting dragged for about a mile after he came
down.
This was exactly what Betty was talking about at the
chute clinic, that getting down is only half the battle. Getting
safely separated from the wreckage and parachute when there's a
strong surface wind is the real trick!
That's all I know
about the supposed tumble.
- Andy
|
Ernie Camacho
Registered
User
(7/11/00 3:48:39 pm)
| Re:
Tumble at King?
Leo was one of those eye witnesses.
If he hadn't landed when he did, he'd have been in that same
air.
Tell us the story, Leo...
|
Leo Jones
Unregistered User
(7/11/00 5:33:23 pm)
| Tumble
at King
The morning of Sunday 8th July at
King Mtn. saw a sky full of wave clouds. By early afternoon as we
prepared to launch these had dissipated somewhat but there were
still lenticulars trying to form over the tops of some of the
cumulus clouds. Winds were fairly strong out of the WSW 20 mph + but
not as strong as on previous days. The task called was route 3, over
the back of the mountain to the East.
I took off at around 2 pm,
in a strengthening wind. It was incredibly smooth - like coastal
flying - with very strong lift into strong thermals. I was at nearly
14,000ft in less than five minutes, but had radio problems and
couldn't leave. I finally sort of fixed this and left with 13,700ft.
It was hard to get higher than this and the cumies were breaking up
as they came over the mountain.
Over the back was colossal sink!
This was followed by even worse sink and jarring turbulence, but
after the last couple of days I wasn't surprised, and just pulled in
and flew on. Ahead was a big cumie forming with a lennie over the
top, but it looked too far to reach in this sink. It was on the
downwind side of some outlying hills/mountains in the valley and I
didn't want to fly over these, fearing I would be very low and get
hammered if I got in the lee of them. I tried to stay to the north
of these hills, out over the open valley, but hit a series of
horrible bumps and finally my left wing was just picked up and
despite me being pulled in all the way with full weight shift I was
just rolled over past vertical until I was nearly upside down. I
pulled in, did a big wingover, came out pointing straight down and
pulled out facing back the way I had come. The sink continued, and I
saw a glider on the ground next to the road out in the valley ahead.
I flew over him with about 2500ft AGL and tried to work bits of
ratty thermal in very nasty air, but I was only going up about 50 ft
per 360 and rapidly drifting downwind toward alluvial washes and low
foothills in front of the Lemhi Range. I was too scared to go back
there in this stuff so low, and I gave in to my strong desire to get
back on the ground! I wondered what the wind was doing down there,
and yelled out to the pilot on the ground when I got down to a few
hundred feet. He kicked dust which whipped away confirming the
strength of the wind. I concentrated on landing and did so OK in
wind which was blowing about 25 - 30 mph but within five minutes of
landing had varied from almost zero to over 35 mph. I was happy to
be down.
We then helped each other pack up our gliders - it took
two people to do this to prevent the gliders from blowing over. As
we were doing so we saw another glider, a TRX with a green
undersurface, about 1000ft overhead, and I kicked dust to help him
land. However he continued circling (or rather long ovalling!) and
we watched him drift towards the foothills, slowly gaining height. I
remember saying, "rather him than me", before we went back to
packing up the gliders. The next thing the other pilot shouts, "Whoa
- parachute deployment!" I looked up to see the glider coming down
under canopy at a shallow angle, travelling fast in the wind. After
a few seconds he hit the ground a couple of miles away, quite hard,
and the chute continued to billow and the drag the glider along. It
didn't stop. We looked at each other and the other pilot (Alan
Payson) said "I'm going over there" and set off at a run. (It turned
out that the "two miles" was more like six!) A pickup truck then
turned up and a woman asked me if I had seen a green TRX - it was
the guy's girlfriend and she freaked out when I told her what had
happened. I tried to console her telling her the chute had opened
OK, and no-one got killed if their parachute opened, and he might be
scraped up but certainly not dead and probably not badly injured,
and the reason he wasn't on the radio was that the radio probably
was either lost or broken in the deployment or impact, but we could
see the chute still billowing and the glider had moved quite a long
way and I'm not sure that she was convinced. I wasn't. I got on the
radio and Donna called 911 and we waited - there wasn't much more we
could do.
To cut a long story short, apparently the glider got
flipped over and the leading edge broke. The pilot threw his chute
and wasn't hurt when he hit the ground but got dragged for about
half a mile. He either hadn't got or couldn't find a hook knife, and
said he was just sitting on the glider like a kind of sled ride
across the sagebrush and rocks before he managed to wriggle out of
his harness. The glider then really took off without the weight of
the pilot, and was dragged for over a mile before ending up in the
bottom of a canyon in the foothills. We could see this in the
distance but of course had no idea how the pilot was doing! Alan
Payson ran about five miles and forded a river before he encountered
the pilot walking towards him. The sheriff and emergency folks
turned up but he managed to signal to them with the aid of a
signalling miror, and they saw he that he was OK and not still
attached to the glider, and cancelled the
ambulance/medevac!
I am pretty sure that there was still
strong wave over the area when we were flying. The incredibly smooth
strong lift in front of the mountain, the fact that almost no-one
got more than 14,000ft over the mountain, (as the wave flattened the
thermals), the strong sink and horrible turbulence in the lee of the
mountain (wave rotor), the lenny over the cumie over the back, and
the fact that pilots either got flushed in sink and turbulence or
skyed out crossing the valley, depending upon when you left (wave in
sync or out of it), all points to that.
I felt like a bit of a
wuss when I gave up and landed and then watched this guy keep going.
I didn't feel that way five minutes later!
Keep your hook knife
handy and buy a signalling mirror. The sherriff said that they were
still a ways off with the paramedic when he saw the mirror flash -
he said you couldn't miss it. Ernie used one too - tell us about it
Ernie.
Leo
PS We all had great flying at King. It's
awesome. Amost everyone had personal bests. I flew 70 miles to
Challis 3 days running before this flight. The scenery is
spectacular, the thermals incredible, and the locals are friendly.
What a great meet.
|
Ernie
Camacho
Registered
User
(7/11/00 9:15:39 pm)
| Signalling mirror
OK, Leo, I'll talk about the
signalling mirror.
Every flight I had at King is a story that I
could spend hours telling, and Day 3 is a good one. I'll try to keep
the description of the flight brief, and concentrate on the
retrieve.
I left King as I reached 14,000, quickly lost
several hundred over the back, but got it back in a thermal a few
miles away from the mountain - much better than what I'd expected.
But then, I was one of the first of our group to take off so it
seems that I missed the really bad stuff the others encountered
later in the day. I found more lift as I approached the next ridge -
the Lemhi's. I worked it and other lift as I hung out on top of the
ridge waiting for the drifting clouds to pass over me. I finally got
up as high as I thought I could and went over the back of range 2,
and over valley 3, the one with hwy 28 coming down it. This crossing
was similar to the first one (more iffy), but when I got on top of
range 3 I found that there were no clouds in the direction I wanted
to go - out to Dubois in the flat land. Instead the clouds curved
around to the north, following the higher hills. From those hills, a
vast expanse of rolling foothills stretched out to the highway. I'm
new to this XC stuff, but one lesson I've learned is "follow the
clouds", so I did. At first they helped me, some, but not enough.
Half way around the curve I found myself heading for some newly
building clouds next to a hillside facing into the strong WSW wind,
hoping I could ridge soar the hillside if the cloud didn't produce.
The cloud didn't, and I couldn't, so I turned into the wind, and
parked. From a few hundred feet over the ground, I took about 15
minutes to work my way down to the ground, following the sloping,
rolling landscape until I was above a dirt track that wound down to
a decent dirt road pointing toward the highway. I flew the glider
right down to the ground, not getting my feet out until I was five
feet off the ground, and not getting my hands off the base tube
until my wheels touched the ground, like a helicopter landing. I
grabbed the front flying wires as I knelt on the control bar, and
with one hand unzipped and stepped out of my harness. Then I stood
up and with both hands on the nose wires, turned the glider around
so I could break it down. I measured the wind at 10 to 25 with gusts
to 30.
Now for the retrieve. I took a waypoint to get my GPS
coordinates (45.8 miles from launch). I didn't have paper or pencil
(note to self, include in XC gear) to write it down, so I turned off
the GPS (practically dead batteries - note to self, add batteries to
list), hoping I'd be able to bring it back to life when I needed to
read them off.
Using my Larson 1/2 wave, base load, 2 meter,
telescoping antenna on my 12 volt hand held, I managed to reach
Albert who'd landed in valley 3. We traded location info then waited
for our chase vehicles to come in range. Eventually, Vince and Bob
got the info from Albert, and then when they rounded the end of
range 3, they made radio contact with me. I gave them my GPS
coordinates, and Vince with his avaiation GPS that had a map, now
knew just where I was - 10 miles off the main road, up in the hills.
As they came down the main dirt road, I used my signalling mirror to
give them a visual of my position. As it turned out, the mirror was
the deciding factor 'cause there were several small dirt tracks
leading off the main dirt road, and knowing just where I was helped
them decide on which ones to turn down. What they thought would be a
10 minute side trip turned into an hour long retrieve 'cause they
had to go so slow on the rocky track I was on.
So, with
accurate GPS info, a signalling mirror, and good radio
communications, my retrieval was assured.
And, I'm sure glad
I left the mountain early!
|
Ernie
Camacho
Registered
User
(7/12/00 7:34:25 am)
| Route
3
For those of you who read Dean Tiegs
report of flying route 3 a couple weeks before the meet, go back and
read it again now that YOU'VE flown that route. It's amazing how
your perspective changes once you've experienced the same place
yourself. Instead of being a story about a strange place that you
can only attempt to picture in your imagination, it becomes a story
that matches well with your personal experience - "yep, I was right
there".
Now, if I'd only memorized his story, I might have
angled out into the desert instead of following the clouds into the
mountains...
I think I'll post his story here so I can delete
the "preparing for King" topic.
|
Ernie
Camacho
Registered
User
(7/12/00 7:36:41 am)
| Re:
Route 3
Thought you'd like to read this
story of a recent flight from king, made by Dean Tiegs. Take out
your maps and see if you can follow along...
Date: Tue,
20 Jun 2000 06:52:23 -0700
From: Dean Tiegs
<tiegs4@netzero.net>
Subject: Choices
>I'd like
to hear Deans story about his 85 mi. at
Arco.
>dbm
Winds were forecast to be strong at the
upper levels in SE Idaho. The two most respected King pilots opted
not to fly because they were "feeling conservative". Launch
conditions were great with good 15 mph cycles coming pretty much
straight in and no dusties crawling up the spine behind
you.
Went immediately to the pine spine and soared up it in
thermal/ridge lift. Piddled around the top at 10 to 11,000 for a
bit until I caught a strong one over King and in no time I realized
I had a rockandrollmeanmotherfukker (pardon my french) and had only
a few seconds to make a choice and then I was over the back with a
bull by the horns. A death grip on the bar turning into the lift, in
fear of what the lift would do to me on this turn, afraid to make
any changes in my turn only because I'd made it thru the last one
this way. I don't know how strong the lift was,looking at my vario
wasn't high on my lift of priorities but it was
like flying
around in the same air as a monstrous invisible crazily spinning
rope,waiting and fearing the next time it hits you. I topped
out,wore out,lost it, at 15500,well behind King and the Lost River
Range. The Atos has been blooded on true King mountain air.
A
long glide to the Lemhi's 17 miles away. I love this glider! Hit the
Lemhi's in front of Saddle MT at 10,000. Hitting light lift and
drifting with it to the peaks trying to get back up.
Managed
to reach Saddle MT with 500/1000 over But no strong
thermal to
take over the back to protect me from the inevitable rotor behind
the range. I turn back upwind and am parked into the strong headwind
and am aghast to see that what I've just drifted across is a series
of monstrous rock and tree filled chasms stretching out in front of
me to the SW, effectively blocking my escape route.
Another
choice stupid. Try to fly out thru one of the canyons or go over the
back into the rotor. Right over the saddle next to the peak with
just seconds to choose and every one wasted that much lower and
deeper into the rotor if I choose to jump. Can't reach my ground
crew to let them
know the score. @#%$!
Over the back we
go. Nice and smooth 1400 down, not so bad after all. All the way
down to 7,000,angling toward the road across the desert until I fly
out of the rotor and begin to hit light lift . Seeing a large dust
devil to the south I change course toward it catching my best
thermal
of the day to 17,700 drifting another 10 miles or so
toward goal of Island Park in the process.
I'm in touch with
my ground crew again!!! They've finally rounded the southern tip of
the Lost River range and come in range. After my flight yesterday
I'd realized the connecter had come apart on my dipole antennae.
Laziness had necessitated the use of a piece of @#%$ rubber duck for
this flight. God I promise to you right here and now I will never
again fly with a piece of @#%$ rubber duck antennae !!
I'm at
cloudbase now and becoming quite chilled despite the heavy clothes,
insulated harness, sheepskin bar mitts. My new Oxy system I'd put
together is working fine. The Icaro helmet visor is predictably
fogging up as every snowmobile helmet I've ever owned has done.I
really do like this helmet though. I could put the shield down most
of the way blocking the worst of the wind. I'm still learning to fly
this wonderful creature called Atos, still trying to figure out the
benefits of the different bank angles and flap settings. Learned a
new trick on this flight. Inreased flap = less airspeed = lower wind
chill factor!
Going on glide to Dubois 20 miles away.
Reaching ground speeds in excess of 75 mph at times without really
pushing the glider at all, due to the strong tailwind.
As I
approach Dubois I have to choose between angling toward Dubois and
some nice looking clouds or some nicer looking clouds further to the
N and more on my direct route. I take the N route. Mistake. From
that point crossing Interstate15 at 12,000' I could only find
light,altitude loss delaying stuff until I landed just NE of
Kilgor, 3 miles from where I'd landed 3 weeks ago and way short of
Island Park. If I had chosen to take the Southern route it would
have kept me more over the desert and maybe in the better lift. I
was on the ground before 5:00, plenty of time for a 100 or even a
150 miler. Damn!!
I'd like to say something really cool and
inspiring about the choices we get to and are forced to make in this
sport that can affect not only our performance but even whether we
stay on this earth much longer and how special we are as a group
that we are willing to trust in our own judgement to this degree,
how I can never feel more alive than thermalling out with a dust
devil below and a cloud above, but I'm not that way so I'll just say
that the worst choice of all would have been to stay at home and
help Kevin and Cory build their new Jungle
Gym.
DCTiegs
Idaho
|
Ernie
Camacho
Registered
User
(7/15/00 9:51:07 pm)
| Leo's
story discussed on the HG list:
Here's some comments from the Hang
Gliding mailing list about the Leo's description of Day
3:
First, Dutcher Sterling asks:
Does anyone have any
information on the King Meet?
I have heard rumors of a
deployment sans link knife and a silk sled ride. If this is so then
we all need to make sure we have a way to cut ourselves loose as
this is surely not a bells jing- jingling!
Fly Safe or Don't
=====================================
Kevin Frost
responds with:
>At 08:14 AM 07/12/2000 -0600, Dutcher
Sterling wrote:
>
Does anyone have any information on the King Meet?
Check out
the cool reports from the Sonoma guys. I already wrote mine, and
it's getting the Burr treatment, but it kind of pales to the jazz
coming out of these guys who traveled a long distance to a strange
place and had adventure. A very hep pack of Kool Kats, you would
never believe they were Kalifornians. See ya next year guys.
KF
=======================================
Nice of Kevin,
wasn't it? Then Dennis Holverstreet has to throw this into the
ring:
Ok, I took a look. Great stories but one thing REALLY
bothered me about the California guys'
accounts.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Over
the back was colossal sink! This was followed by
even worse sink
and jarring turbulence, but after the
last couple of days I
wasn't surprised, and just pulled
in and flew on. Ahead was a
big cumie forming with a
lennie over the top, but it looked too
far to reach in this
sink.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
DUDES!!!!
Those "cummies" under lennies are called ROTOR clouds. Those things
can bust a sailplane into a thousand pieces and are death to hang
gliders. Don't mess with 'em. Run away, run
away!!!!
--
Dennis
=====================================
Dean
Tiegs responds with:
Sorry to disagree Dennis but the cummies
were definitely "pure" cumulus clouds unaltered by strong winds. My
best part of the flight was spent at 16,000 ft. with Tom Vayda,
dipping in and out of one of them. I'll admit though that the fun
went out of the flight when I had to land in the 25-35 mph winds out
on the desert flats. It was a fantastic weekend for King but I'm not
giving any details 'cause this place is gettin' too crowded as it
is. Why, I even had three other guys flyin' it with me just 3
weekends ago! Couldn't hardly turn without hittin' sumthin"!
Sheesh!!
DCTiegs
Idaho
======================================
And
Kevin Frost adds:
Kind of funny how different pilots can
experience the same day and route so differently. I left King with
15,500+ and made it past the middle of the valley with around
12,000' experiencing pretty smooth air compared to previous days.
Got back up to around 14,000 to cross the Lemhi's, worked
light
lift in the middle of the next valley to 13,000, then never found
another decent thermal, played the zero sink game until the strong
southern lower altitudes made me play the crab game, about a mile
short of the end of the blue hole, the guys who made that first
cloud had 100 milers. I had a pretty relaxing flight, until the
halfway rowdy landing. Not sure if I'm too scared of a nice looking
cloud out in flatland with a leni way above it, if things were that
nasty the cummies would be broken
up.
KF
====================================
Then,
Dennis responds to Kevin's remarks:
Kevin writes:
> Not
sure if I'm
> too scared of a nice looking cloud out in
flatland with a
>leni way above it, if things were that nasty the
cummies
>would be broken up.
Sure, agreed. I guess the key
thing is "nice looking"..... good flat bottom, etc. I wasn't there
and it could have just been a cu. But pilots need to be aware that
there's always a big rotor under a lennie, even if it isn't marked
with a cloud. This one sure sounds suspicious. The pilot was
getting beat up by the turbulence and landed in high winds. His
buddy pressed on toward the "cu" under the lennie and
tumbled.
--
Dennis
==========================================
And
of course, Kevin shoots back with:
At 12:05 AM 07/13/2000
-0700, Dennis Holverstott wrote:
>The pilot was getting beat
up by the turbulence and landed
>in high winds. His buddy pressed
on toward the "cu" under
>the lennie and tumbled.
The rest
of the story is about 50-60 other pilots flew under that same cloud,
me at 14,000'. Some turbulence in areas, but nothing compared to the
stuff on the range. Did the guy get tumbled or did his wing break
first? High winds? Zero wind landings have been scaring me so much
lately that I was liking it. There will be a good picture of the end
result of the glider drag in the next Burr Report. Bottom line, I'm
happily amazed the guy wasn't
hurt.
KF
================================
But, to
wrap things up, Andy Long (you lurker!) forwards the
definitive
description from Leo:
Leo Jones, the pilot who
described the cumulus with the lenni over it at King,
writes:
Dennis, Thanks for your concern, but these cumulus I
referred to were not rotor clouds. They were well formed cumulus
that by virtue of their mass and inertia form a "mountain" that a
mid or upper level airmass rises over, to form lenticular clouds
over the top. This is a not uncommon phenomenon, but these are not
to be confused with the wave rotor clouds that can form under a
wave. These are usually smaller cumulus type clouds with raggedy
edges, and often remain in one place and do not drift much downwind.
The cloud that I flew towards after going over the back of King
Mountain was a well formed "cumulus majestus" with sharp cauliflower
edges, a flat dark base and was sailing, by its shadow, downwind at
a good clip. I judged it to be about three thousand feet high and
about three miles across at the base. It had a nice little
lenticular cloud sitting right on top of it. If I could'a got there
I could'a soared right up to it! I wouldn't go near a wave rotor
cloud in a hang glider either, though I flew in small ones in
sailplanes over the Sierras to try to climb into wave. That is not
unusual. It depends upon the size of the wave.
Small wave rotors
can often be mistaken for cumulus wisps, but they tend to be
persistent and remain in the same place. Large ones have about as
much attraction for a pilot as a tornado or big cu nimb. Much of the
lift over the Idaho mountains that day was a combination of thermal
augmented by wave. It provided exhilarating and challenging flying
for hang gliders, with big smooth lift and big turbulent sink.
That's what you get if you fly in some places out west. The King
Mountain Meet was one of the best organised and most fun XC meets I
have ever been to. Lisa and Terri did a fantastic job, so did the
task committee, and just about everyone had wonderful flights. It
was an absolute blast flying with those Idaho boys.
Phew! I
can't wait to go back.
Leo
Jones
=======================================
Dennis could
only respond to Kevin's last remark with:
> The rest of
the story is about 50-60 other pilots flew
>under that same
cloud, me at 14,000'. Some turbulence in
>areas, but nothing
compared to the stuff on the range.
Yeah, I got a private
note from Leo. He knew exactly what he was doing and my fears about
wave rotors were unfounded. Apologies for crying wolf.
--
Dennis
===========================================
|
Ernie Camacho
Registered
User
(7/32/00 9:51:07 pm)
|
King Mt. Meet results
2000 King Mountain Hang Gliding Championships Results
Open Class
272.6 Steve Rewolinski
270 John Woiwode
241 Kurt Ziegler
227 Dan Gravage
219 Dean Tiegs
217 Lisa Verzella
207 Paris Williams
202 Zac Majors
200.5 Frank Gillette
195.8 Wayne Lueth
195.8 Heiner Biesel
190.4 Shannon Raby
188 Tom Vayda
186.6 Kevin Frost
182.7 Ken Muscio
180.7 Mike Branger
170 Claire Packer
166.3 Leo Jones
160 Dennis Harris
159 Steve Rathbun
154.8 Harold Froehling
154.6 Peter Swanson
150 KC Benn
143 Will Lanier
144 Karl Hallman
137 Ken Schreck
134.3 Dano Broyles
134 Kurt Bainum
119 Gregg Brauch
108 Don Lepinsky
95.4 Jeff Mazer
93.7 Jeff Gildehaus
86 Gary Braun
83 Alan Paylor
78.3 Joe Decleur
64 Hank Butzel
56 Kurt Wimberg
45 Paul Eckerson
21 Mark Mason
14 Chris Kastner
<7.3> Scot Huber
N/S Mike Davis
N/S Craig Hines
RECREATION CLASS
219.9 Jimmy Pricer
210 Peter Bovingdon
198 Albert Branson
194.5 Bob Stanley
189 Joe Brakefield
184.9 Ernie Camacho
180 Mike Branger
160.8 Doug McCellan
150 KC Benn
148.6 Cory Rose
145 Nat Wells
134.2 Bill Snyder
85 Jeff Shapiro
85 Calvin Mills
70 Ron Allmon
67 Vince Endter
65 Woody Bateman
56 Blaine Perkins
53.1 Steven Johnson
45 Angelo Mantas
42 Ron Matous
30 Scott Thorburn
28 Larry Roberts
20 Lee Minardi
12 Scot Trueblood
2.5 Dave Corbin
.05 Rose Carter
0 Phil Olson
0 Wayne Mayo
0 Gary Robinson
<7.3> Scot Huber
N/S Craig Hines
|
|